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Another insufficient cooling issue

Hoverfly on Thu July 31, 2008 4:39 PM User is offline

Year: 2002
Make: Toyota
Model: Celica GT-S
Engine Size: 1.8
Refrigerant Type: 134A
Ambient Temp: 76
Pressure Low: 46
Pressure High: 175
Country of Origin: United States

My car is not cooling down enough on hot days or when the sun is out on warm days, sitting at a stop sign or cooling the car down after sitting. I pulled a vac for two hours and replaced the Freon. Both fans go to high when running AC. Now things get better at highway speeds and the inside air drops so that I can adj air temp, but not so when standing still.

the numbers

@ 900 rpm, low 46 high 175.

@ 2000 rpm low 35 high 200.

Inside air temp 59

Out side air 75F and humid.

TRB on Thu July 31, 2008 10:25 PM User is offlineView users profile

Looks over charged, how much refrigerant did you add back to the system?

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Hoverfly on Fri August 01, 2008 10:51 AM User is offline

I put in 15oz. Required amount is less than a pound, somthing like .96lb +/- 1oz

TRB on Fri August 01, 2008 11:01 AM User is offlineView users profile

Compressor Oil Capacity 4.1 ozs.
Condenser Oil Capacity 1.4 ozs.
Evaporator Oil Capacity 1.4 ozs.
Refrigerant (R-134a) Capacity 14.1-16.2 ozs.
System Operating Pressures
High Side 199-228 psi (14-16 kg/cm2 )
Low Side 21-36 psi (1.5-2.5 kg/cm2 )
With ambient temperature at 86-95°F (30-35°C) at air inlet with switch in RECIRC position,
engine at 1500 RPM, blower switch in HI position and temperature control dial in COOL
position.

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Contact: ACKits.com

Hoverfly on Fri August 01, 2008 12:37 PM User is offline

Well even with the recirc it takes a while to cool down, it this normal with regular 134? In the past it did not seem so. Should I check into looking in to the more expensive stuff like the Sub Zero Synthetic? Fans motors seem to be working, condenser coil is clean dinged up a little though, better fan blades? That might help, would you think?

NickD on Fri August 01, 2008 1:17 PM User is offline

Hmmm, Toyota's are reliable, or least use to be, with that little refrigerant and those high pressures, that cold of an ambient, kind of suggests you have air in the system, lot's of air.

Can you add anything to that?

TRB on Fri August 01, 2008 1:26 PM User is offlineView users profile

Quote
Originally posted by: NickD
Hmmm, Toyota's are reliable, or least use to be, with that little refrigerant and those high pressures, that cold of an ambient, kind of suggests you have air in the system, lot's of air.



Can you add anything to that?

Agree with this assessment.



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When considering your next auto A/C purchase, please consider the site that supports you: ACkits.com
Contact: ACKits.com

Hoverfly on Fri August 01, 2008 1:35 PM User is offline

Yeah I got a vac pump, I had it on before I added refringent for at leat two hours. I have not seen any large amount of bubbles in the sight glass. What if I did not pull a vac on the whole system and just part of it? I have both gauge hoses on and open, does the system self isolate some how or did I do something wrong and did not pull a full vac?

mk378 on Fri August 01, 2008 1:57 PM User is offline

Has anyone added oil? Too much oil will hinder performance. Maybe air got in while changing the hose over to charge. Was it a real vacuum pump or one of those air-powered ones? The air-powered pump does not produce a full vacuum.

There is no advantage to the "synthetic" stuff. You know it can work well on plain R-134a.

Hoverfly on Fri August 01, 2008 2:11 PM User is offline

I thought of to much oil I did do a 2oz charge, but looks like I lost that much or less when I dumped the system a second time around to work on it. I have an electric motor operated pump, so puling a vac is not an issue I use to do home heating/ac so I have some compatible equipment. I am thinking my engine runs to low at idle 800/900 with out a/c engaged. I use full synthetics maybe I need to do a slight idle adjustment?

Edited: Fri August 01, 2008 at 2:17 PM by Hoverfly

mk378 on Fri August 01, 2008 2:50 PM User is offline

Increasing the idle rpm would improve performance at idle. On modern fuel injected cars though the idle speed is not adjustable, it's fully controlled by the computer.

Hoverfly on Fri August 01, 2008 3:24 PM User is offline

So if I make an adjustment to the set screw on the throttle body, the computer would counter act that?

NickD on Fri August 01, 2008 3:31 PM User is offline

If the vehicle has AT and you drive in traffic, last thing you want to do is to increase the idle speed, torque converter would way overheat, yeah, they can be shimmed.

Whats missing in your post is why you decided to vacuum down, in some R-134a systems a loss of up to 10% per year is possible and times six years! Just a top off is required, hey, we don't control neither the EPA nor the OE's and the EPA let's this slip by. And if you did lose oil, always a wild ass guess as to how much, wanna do it right, flush, replace the receiver and start over again. If you lost refrigerant over the years, always a question as to how much and whether it's acceptable or not. But if your system only holds 0.96 pounds and taking your word for it, just a couple of ounces would make a huge difference in cooling.

mk378 on Fri August 01, 2008 3:32 PM User is offline

That's how Hondas work anyway. The screw lets in a baseline amount of air. The computer varies the idle air valve, admitting additional air to reach the programmed target rpm. As you start turning the screw the idle air valve will just close down to compensate. Eventually after the computer has closed the valve fully, continuing to turn the screw, the idle will go up out of control and the CEL will probably come on. You will have a situation where the idle is way high with the A/C off (which is of no use to you) but it slows down with the A/C on.

Hoverfly on Fri August 01, 2008 5:14 PM User is offline

The car is a 6 speed standard, the computer compensates when the compressor kicks in, an increase not decrease, increase in RPM. This is why I am thinking idle adjustment. Any way I am off to Maine for the week end with the Civic so I know keeping cool is not going to be a issue. Next week I will look at again.

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